This was a reread for me, just like book 1 was. What is funny for me is that I remembered almost verbatim what happened in book 1, 40 years after reading it the first time. Book 2 however was a completely different experience in that I remembered almost nothing from my original read of this one from all that time ago. I remembered it once I was finished, but nothing stuck with me of the details. I think my teenage mind didn't connect with book 2 because it was much less about the action and more about the political and religious overtones. Now, I was much more interested in the intrigue, and the result was boosting my review by a star. Now, I'll be tackling book 3 for the first time, and looking forward to seeing the further resolution of what started in these two books.

3.5 stars. It was good but not as good as Dune. Needed more action. Looking forward to the next one in the series!

Buddy read with Athena!

"Once more the drama begins."
- The Emperor Paul Muad'dib on his ascension to the Lion Throne

Twelve years have passed since the Battle of Arrakeen, where Paul Atreides wrestled the Imperium from the hands of the Padishah Emperor, and seized the Lion Throne for himself. Dune has become the political and economical centre of the universe, and the Qizarate priesthood has spread Muad'dib's name throughout space and turned him into not only an emperor with absolute power, but a god in his own right.

Yet there are those who would topple the god emperor from his religious throne. In the grand circles of power, a new conspiracy arises from the shadows. Its goals and ambitions are many, and it seeks to infiltrate the ranks of the Atreides and the Fremen, striking at those closest to the emperor in order to remove him from power. And each step brings its plans closer to succeeding.

"Mysterious, lethal, an oracle without eyes,
Catspaw of prophecy, whose voice never dies!"

Dune Messiah is, in many ways, even better than Dune. It cannot stand up to the wonder of discovering the world of Arrakis for the first time, but it certainly has other strengths. The setting and the writing style is mostly the same as in the first book. The story though, has changed dramatically. The first book is about Paul Atreides and his quest for vengeance against those who betrayed his family and seized their land. The second book is about managing an empire and protecting it from a devilishly dangerous conspiracy who shuns no means to achieve what they want. There is more political maneuvering, more hidden agendas, and more excitement for the reader.

The character have also grown more interesting in the second book. Paul, Chani and Irulan are all older and more experienced in the games of power, and were much more enjoyable to read about than they were in the first one. And perhaps the most fascinating character of them all is Alia, Paul's sister. Still only fifteen years of age, she is both a Reverend Mother of the Bene Gesserit, a leader of the Qizarate priesthood, and a powerful voice in the Imperial Council.

What truly made me decide to let this book keep the five stars from the first time I read it, was the ending. I will not go into details about it, but only say that this may be the most beautiful ending I have ever read in a sci-fi or fantasy book ever.

For those of you who have read Dune and are debating with yourselves whether or not to read its sequels, I hope this review will be helpful in deciding. For those of you who haven't read any of the books from this universe, know that it is in my eyes one of the greatest fictional series of all time. I would definitely recommend it to every single one of you, because it's a wonderful story with few equals in the world of science fiction.

Such a rich store of myths enfolds Paul Muad'dib, the Mentat Emperor, and his sister, Alia, it is difficult to see the real persons behind these veils. But there were, after all, a man born Paul Atreides and a woman born Alia. Their flesh was subject to space and time. And even though their oracular powers placed them beyond the usual limits of time and space, they came from human stock. They experienced real events which left real traces upon a real universe. To understand them, it must be seen that their catastrophe was the catastrophe of all mankind. This work is dedicated, then, not to Muad'dib or his sister, but to their heirs - to all of us.
- Dedication in the Muad'dib Concordance as copied from The Tabla Memorium of the Mahdi Spirit Cult

Dune Messiah (Dune #2), Frank Herbert

Dune Messiah is a science fiction novel by American writer Frank Herbert, the second in his Dune series of six novels. Twelve years after the events described in Dune (1965), Paul "Muad'Dib" Atreides rules as Emperor. By accepting the role of messiah to the Fremen, Paul had unleashed a jihad which conquered most of the known universe. While Paul is the most powerful emperor ever known, he is powerless to stop the lethal excesses of the religious juggernaut he has created.

Although 61 billion people have perished, Paul's prescient visions indicate that this is far from the worst possible outcome for humanity. Motivated by this knowledge, Paul hopes to set humanity on a course that will not inevitably lead to stagnation and destruction, while at the same time acting as ruler of the empire and focal point of the Fremen religion. ...

تاریخ نخستین خوانش: روز سی ام ماه نوامبر سال2018میلادی

عنوان: مسیحای تلماسه: کتاب دوم از سری تلماسه؛ نویسنده: فرانک هربرت؛ مترجم: مهیار فروتن فر؛ تهران، نشر کتابسرای تندیس، سال1397؛ در320ص؛ فروست: شاهکارهای ادبیات علمی تخیلی؛ شابک9786001823244؛ چاپ دوم سال1398؛ موضوع داستانهای نویسندگان ایالات متحده آمریکا - سده20م

ماجرای نبرد میان سه خاندان بزرگ بر سر مالکیت این سیاره و قصه قهرمان افسانه ای «فرمن»ها به نام «پل مودِب» است که با تکیه بر اندیشه های پیچیده فلسفی، روان شناختی، سیاسی، بوم شناسی و…؛ نگارش شده است؛ «مسیحای تلماسه» ادامه داستان «پائول آتریدس» است، مردی که «مودب» را مسیحی کرد، او به عنوان فرمانروای جهان شناخته شده، بیش از آنچه که یک فرد میباید قدرت داشته باشد دارای قدرت بود؛ او به نمادی مذهبی تبدیل شده بود و توسط تندروها پرستش میشد؛ با اینحال به خاطر جابجاییهای سیاسی که در زمان تصاحب تاج و تخت انجام داده بود مورد نفرت بسیاری قرار گرفته است و با توطئه نفوذ مواجه شد؛ و حتی وقتی خانه «آتریدس» در اطراف او شروع به از دست دادن اعتبار خود میکند، توطئه ای دیگر معشوق او، «چانی»، و وارث متولد نشده سلسله خانوادگیش را تهدید میکند...؛ میلیونها نسخه از کتابهای باشکوه «مسیحای تلماسه» در سراسر جهان فروخته شده، دوازده سال پس از چیرگی «پل مودب»، پیشوای پیشگو، بر غاصبان، و تکیه زدن ایشان بر سریر سیادت، نه تنها «تلماسه» که همه ی کائنات جهان زخم خورده، سرانجام از بستر بهت برخاسته، و بنای انتقام میگذارند؛ ...؛ سری کتابهای تلماسه رمانهای علمی- تخیلی هستند، روایتی شگفت انگیز که در سال1965میلادی جان گرفت و فضایی از آینده ای دور را به تصویر کشاند؛ این سری بازگویی ماجرای نبرد میان سه خاندان بزرگ بر سر مالکیت این سیاره و قصه ی قهرمان افسانه ای «فرمن»ها به نام «پل مودِب» است که با تکیه بر اندیشه های پیچیده ی فلسفی، روان شناختی، سیاسی، بوم شناسی و…؛ نگاشته شده اند؛

نقل از متن: («پل» آهی کشید و در این فکر فرورفت که چطور هر دنیایی که به دست لشکریانش فتح، و به منبعی تازه برای زوار بدل میشود، زواری که به سپاس از «صلح و آرامش اعطایی مودب» به زیارت «آراکیس» میآمدند؛ با خود گفت: بله، همه جا صلح و آرامش هست؛ همه جا…؛ جز در قلب «مودب»؛ احساس میکرد که عنصری از عناصر وجودش، در ژرفنای بی پایان ظلماتی منجمد، غرق شده است؛ قدرت پیشگویانه ی او تصویری را که همگان از جهان داشتند، دستکاری کرده بود؛ او جهان امنی را که همه میشناختند زیر و رو کرده بود، و امن و امانش را با «کورساد» خود جایگزین کرده بود؛ او ثابت کرده بود که در زور و فکر و آینده نگری سرتر از جهان انسانهاست، ولی ته دلش مطمئن بود که جهان هنوز دست خود را تمام و کمال برایش رو نکرده است)؛ پایان نقل

تاریخ بهنگام رسانی 28/06/1399هجری خورشیدی؛ 23/02/1401هجری خورشیدی؛ ا. شربیانی

Only half the length of the original Dune, the second book in the series takes place 12 years after.

Not as epic, this is almost like a chamber western, with political intrigue and references to great goings on, but little action described. The feel of the book is like a prelude to what comes next, that the third book will be the true sequel to Dune.

For fans of Dune, no doubt, and you really need to have read Dune first, to know the characters and to at least have a clue about Herbert's complex and intricately detailed world building.

But then, comparing this book to Dune is like comparing a country lawyer to a Supreme Court justice, the comparison itself is unfair, very few books will equal Dune or even come close. Dune Messiah is part of Herbert's great vision and is a good book in its own right.

*** 2019 Reread

Coming back to this book years later and after having read all of the first six that Frank Herbert, I have a better appreciation for Herbert's great vision. Describing a conspiracy against Paul after his conquest of the Universe, and devastation of myriad worlds and billions of lives lost, the author creates a setting of disquiet, as Leto's time in the Dune universe begins.

Herbert's literary grasp of theology, ideology and spiritualism is on full display and this is an important book in his canon.

5.0 stars. Second volume in the superb Dune series. I actually liked this volume even more than Dune. If possible I would recommend listening to the audio version of this series as the production value is amazing. HIGHEST POSSIBLE RECOMMENDATION!!!!

dune messiah is about how too much power can be the cause of your downfall. it’s shows the white savior in the lens that it needs to be shown in, a negative one. this book was very controversial when it came out and most fans of dune hated it; that’s why i like this book and the series. you need to read the entire series to get the full story, you think that you know everything from the first book and dune messiah chances everything you think you know. that’s why i love this book.

خیلی با خودم کلنجار رفتم که پنج بدم یا نه
در نهایت به چهار کفایت می‌کنم، فرانک هربرت، وقتی رسیدم جلد آخر مجموعه، نامه‌ی عاشقانه‌ای درخور شاهکاری که توی تلماسه کردی می‌نویسم.


جلد دوم هیچگونه عقب گردی نداره بلکه گامی به سوی جلو هست و مرزهای جدیدی از نبوغ نویسنده‌ای به نام فرانک هربرت رو به جهانیان نشون میده، من قبلاً سابقه ستایش ایده‌ی بنیاد رو در کارنامه‌ام داشتم ولی به نظرم تلماسه‌ست که اینجا به سرحد کمال خلاقیت در کل آثار علمی‌تخیلی می‌رسه، این ایده خوبه، واقع‌گرایانه‌ست و واقعاً استادانه پرداخت شده.

من قبلاً دین خودم رو به تلماسه ادا کردم، معرفی‌نامه‌ای براش نوشتم که همینجا هم دوباره میذارم اگه دوست دارید چک کنید، ولی خب امیدوارم فرصتی فراهم بشه من بتونم بیشتر راجع به تلماسه با تمام علاقمندان صحبت کنم.

Priodan nastavak prvog dela ove neverovatne sage. Politika, religija, zavera, zalog za buducnost, ljubav i Mesija Dine.

Philosophical and intricate, on the corrupting influence of power and opulence, combined with the unchanging march of time and the prison predestination can be
Empires do not suffer emptiness of purpose at the time of their creation. It is when they have become established that aims are lost and replaced by vague ritual.

Ceremony and symbolism taking over belief and morality, similar to how success on the battlefield made elite soldiers pampered and materialistic, and all that after just 12 years. Dune Messiah opens up differently than one might imagine after Dune, not with the problems of the Jihad (and the 61 billion dead it caused, which we are told in passing by Frank Herbert) but focusing rather on the corrupting influence of enormous power and wealth. Forces are stirring against Paul and his reign, mimicking Newton’s “every action has an equal and opposite reaction” and Hegel’s pendulum take on history, but the biggest danger to the emperor comes from time and the burden the visions themselves bring with them. Bastions of power are destroyed and own power is reinforced in the end, albeit at the cost of a highest of sacrifices.

I would call this book brilliant in concept, but my heart was never really touched. There are golems, resurrected flesh, vast bureaucracies and massive conspiracies. But the characters, maybe due to their elevated perception of time, feel ephemeral and going through the motions, instead of being in the moment acutely in danger. Alia, sister to Paul, being sexualised and incest being part of some plans, strikes me as very Egyptian pharaoh like. Also the whole insta love surrounding her and some other main character felt sloppy. And then we have Chani being nearly invisible, maybe speaking five sentences in the whole book...

Still I am sure I will read into Children of Dune at some point, yet this sequel in my view could not stand up against Dune.

Quotes in both Dutch and English:
Reason is the first victim of strong emotion

They are not mad. They're trained to believe, not to know. Belief can be manipulated. Only knowledge is dangerous

Maar het was nou eenmaal het onvermijdelijke lot van macht om belegerd te worden

Deze is praatziek maar wel diepzinnig

Een keizer is meer dan een mens, zijn persoonlijkheid leidt het rijk

Dit was geen lichtzinnig gedane gift, hij gaf eerlijke antwoorden op gevaarlijke vragen

Truth suffers from too much analysis

Zij bewoog het zwaard niet, het zwaard bewoog haar

We kunnen niets voor eeuwig voorkomen

Alle macht is beperkt

Uw vernietigen sire? Kan iemand een god doden?

Hoe kan hij zichzelf tegen zichzelf beschermen?

Daar geloof je niets van dus waarom zou je het zeggen?

De mensen willen geen boekhouder als keizer maar een meester, iemand die hen beschermd tegen veranderingen

Jouw waarachtigheid is gevaarlijk

Je bent dronken van teveel tijd

Jij bent bang voor je eigen macht
Je troost me met doorns

Here lies a toppled god.
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.

You do not beg the sun for mercy.

Mijn regering is de economie

Was het een nederlaag als je van twee kwaden de minste kiest?

Te veel vrijheid kweekt wanorde

Hij hield hen allen in de palm van zijn visioen

De macht die zelfs de allemachtigsten kunnen uitoefenen zonder zichzelf te vernietigen is begrensd

Ik zal doen wat de liefde van me verlangd

Ik sterf aan mijn eigen voorzienigheid

Maar er zijn problemen in dit heelal waarvoor geen oplossing bestaat

There are problems in this universe for which there are no answers. Nothing. Nothing can be done.

The story was good, but wow, does this thing need a heavy editing. It really should've been a short story. Better yet, the entire story could be contained in quoted histories at the beginning of each chapter in an entirely different sequel. That would've been much more enjoyable.

Glad I read it, but holy crap was this thing a mess.

Dune Messiah starts off a dozen years after the end of the first book in the Dune series. Paul is at the top of the world, but you know what they say- it's a long way down from the top. Paul might be in for a long fall. Paul's supernatural abilities do not grant him an easy way out of his problems. Quite on the contrary, Paul's divine statue creates a whole new set of moral issues for our hero. The sequel to Dune is quite different in tone, although the setting is just as fascinating as ever. There is a note of bitterness in this sequel that warms of dangers of ultimate power. ...“There are many degrees of sight and many degrees of blindness. What senses do we lack that we cannot see another world all around us?”

Ironically, Paul we meet in this book often seems a broken man. He is perhaps captured by his own greatness. Paul has unlashed a Jihad on the world that resulted in death of many innocents. By many, I mean billions. That's a lot of blood to be carrying on one's hand. Moreover, Paul's numerous enemies are plotting against him. You could say that the adrenaline of the victory is over and there is a sense of weariness in Paul. The emperor is troubled, he cannot father a child with his beloved concubine and he refused to touch his wife- the princess Irulan. The empire grows restless without an heir. The melancholically inclined Paul ponders power and his role in the world: ...“Constitutions become the ultimate tyranny," Paul said. "They’re organized power on such a scale as to be overwhelming. The constitution is social power mobilized and it has no conscience. It can crush the highest and the lowest, removing all dignity and individuality. It has an unstable balance point and no limitations.”

Politics are closely examined in this novel. There is less action then in the first one. The action almost happens behind the scenes as different power structures are at work. ...“There exists a limit to the force even the most powerful may apply without destroying themselves. Judging this limit is the true artistry of government. Misuse of power is the fatal sin. The law cannot be a tool of vengeance, never a hostage, nor a fortification against the martyrs it has created. You cannot threaten any individual and escape the consequences.”

If lacking in action, I found Dune Messiah quite touching. As Lady Jessica drifts from the picture, the focus is now fully on Paul and Alia. Paul's sister grows up to be an interesting character in her own right, but her fate might be just as sad. Like her brother Alia is trapped by her greatness and her powers : ...“I didn't want to be different.
I wanted to be able to laugh
But I'm sister to an Emperor who's worshiped as a god. People fear me. I never wanted to be feared.
I don't want to be part of history, I just want to be loved . . . and to love.”... However, there is no mistaking the hero of this book- it's once again Paul. A different hero then the one in Dune, but a hero nevertheless.
“There was a man so wise,
He jumped into
A sandy place
And burnt out both his eyes!
And when he knew his eyes were gone,
He offered no complaint.
He summoned up a vision
And made himself a saint.
-Children's Verse
from History of Muad'dib”

I only now realized that Dune Messiah is one of the few novels in the series that I haven't revisited and reread. I think it is because I find it so darn tragic. I find Dune Messiah to be as valuable as any other book in series, but perhaps not as easy to read because it is filled with bitterness and sadness. After the high that one gets from reading the end of Dune and seeing Paul victorious over his enemies, reading Dune Messiah seems anti-climatic. However, that is the worth of this book. It teaches us about the dangers of power. It shows us how a Messiah cult can grow into something dangerous, something Messiah himself cannot control. It really is an ingenious novel.

“Here lies a toppled god.
His fall was not a small one.
We did but build his pedestal,
A narrow and a tall one.”

UPDATE: I published a more detailed review on my blog if anyone is interested in that:
https://modaodaradosti.blogspot.com/2...