The calculation of literary kink: 2 stars for coming up with an interesting premise (2000 year old man reminiscing about life and his times among the stars) MINUS 1.5 stars for ignoring said premise and instead focusing on taunting every sexual more known to current cultural standards, culminating in time-travel visits to meet Mom and thus begin what I can only describe as pornographic Back To The Future fan-fiction.

Plus half-a-star to have the willpower/stubberness/tone-deafness to continue on despite the oracles and naysayers that must have (justifiably) populated the road to publication.

Philosophical query: if you had sex with an opposing gender clone of yourself, have you committed incest?

Central Powers start WWI in order to thwart protagonist's virtuous matriphiliac desires. As we all know, Germania lost the war, and Lazarus Long had sex with his mother. Germania stayed pissed off and WWII is the result. Ergo, don't fuck your mom or else Nazis.

Can’t get enough of Heinlein. Of the many different authors I’ve read this year it’s his work the most deep, thought provoking and of worthwhile analysis.

A reverse a thousand and one Arabian nights and the oldest living man thou appropriate as a brief summary of the book sell this book too short.

A very intelligent read, filled with moments that evoke many feelings towards Lazarus life and family.

PD. It also has this deconstruction of incest too

This book was not for me.

Heinlein lured me in with the an interesting premise of a long-lived human race leaving earth and colonizing the stars. Instead, I got 600+ pages of Heinlein trying to convince me that incestuous relationships and grooming are okay… not to mention my frustration with the way the women are written. All the women do (and want to do!) are 1 Have sex, 2 get pregnant, and 3 have babies. Ugh. Again - not for me.

TLDR: Sigmund Freud would love this book

Love me some Lazarus Long. This story gives us a few scenes which were (intentionally) missing from "To Sail beyond the Sunset". it also fills in the genealogy of L.L. sisters/clones and a few other important persons.
We finally see what happened when Theodore Bronson disappeared, fighting a war that he only went into to make Mama Maureen think well of him. And we get to see more of Ira Johnson.
Super reading.

קראתי למועדון קריאה ולכן אכתוב כאן מספר נקודות (כולל ספוילרים, אם כי העלילה לא ממש קריטית) -

תארו לעצמכם את גרסת ריק ומורטי ל-"שם הרוח" של פטריק רות'פוס, עם ריק סאנצ'ס כגיבור ניהלסיטי שובר מוסכמות, שנכפה עליו לספר את קורות חייו הארוכים.
הסיפורים כלשעצמם (העצלן הגאון, העיוור, דורה, התאומים, החזרה בזמן) מוצלחים ברובם. הבעיה היא שהם מהווים פחות ממחצית (קרוב יותר לשליש) הספר. כך, לדוגמה, בגרסה העברית, מתוך 150 העמודים הראשונים, עמ' 82-60 מוקדשים לסיפור על דייב לאמב (5 כוכבים), עמ' 132-126 לסיפור על נויזי העיוור (גם הוא סיפור מוצלח, 5 כוכבים), וכל השאר לבקשות חוזרות ונישנות מהגיבור לספר את סיפוריו (כולל אחרי שכבר התחיל) ודיונים פולוסופים (העיקר היינלין מנצל כל הזדמנות לרדת על פילוסופים). הדמויות שנונות, משעשעות וחצופות (כולן, כולל הדמויות בכל ספר אחר של היינלין שקראתי בסדרה) אבל ישנו גבול שמעבר לו שנינות הופכת לסתם התחכמות.
ניסיתי לחשוב מהו המסר העיקרי שאותו מנסה הסופר להעביר. לדעתי מדובר בניסיון לגרום לנו להזדהות עם הגיבור (לזארוס לונג) ודיעותיו החורגות מהנורמה, בעיקר בכל הקשור לגילוי עריות (בשלב מזסויים הלכתי לבדוק ונרגעתי כשגיליתי שלהיינלין לא היו ילדים). אם אכן זו המטרה, הרי שלפחות עבורי, מדובר בכשלון. קראתי ספרים בהם סופרים הצליחו לגרום לקורא לרצות בהצלחתן של דמויות נאלחות (דוגמה מעולה - מרטין לורנס, או בגדול כל תת הז'אנר של גרים-דארק). דעתי לא השתנתה לאורך הספר - לאזרוס לונג הוא one trick pony. הספרים המוצלחים בסדרה (בני מתושלח ובמידה מסויימת גם מספר החיה), הם אלו בהם הוא אחד מתוך גלריה של דמויות, ולא הראשית שבהן. בפרפרזה לתרבות פופולרית - רציתי חברים, קיבלתי ג'ואי.

Like most books by Robert Heinlein this was a pleasure to read and had an interesting and original plot.

I know that some people thought Heinlein was a pervert in his later years (and I agree) I still feel that his books had a solid quality to them. Aside the sex mentioned later on in this book, it was a fantastic read. The various stories and observations shared by Lazarus Long strike true (The story of Lazarus and Dora, and the story of the man who wanted to work as little as possible are the best in my opinion), and if you already enjoyed the collection of short stories titled 'Past through Tomorrow', then you should enjoy the rest of the Lazarus Long/World as Myth books.

Before you read this book however, it is VERY recommended that you get the 'Past through Tomorrow' collection, or this book may be hard to understand in parts.

- Mr. Lazarus Long, since you happen to be passing through the early twenty-first century, could you give us a few priceless gems of homespun wisdom for the Goodreads membership to marvel at?

- Gosh darn it, when I see all the cute females on this site, how can I say no? Could you just pass me the... cuneiform tablets? Papyrus rolls? Parchment? Oh yes, laptop. Sorry, hard to keep things straight. So...

1. If you're a tired SF hack who's completely run out of ideas, don't worry. Just recycle the old ones, and pretend nothing's wrong.

2. You may imagine that the books will come out painfully thin. Far from it. They'll be thicker than ever.

3. Next time someone calls you a motherfucker, simply take them at their word. Of course, a time machine is useful here.

4. Don't make these lists too long. By the time you've got half a dozen items, everyone will already be yawning.

5. Er...

6. That's it.

- Done! Now, surely there's some gorgeous woman here who's dying to have sex with me?

1.5
“Time Enough for Love” is a book that is not worth your time.

Plot: The framing story is that Lazarus Long has lived for such a long time that he has given up on life and needs to find something that convinces him it is still worth living. However, the real story is about Lazarus’s sexual escapades across time and space. This is what the majority of “Time’s” pages are focused on, which is too bad because the book becomes repetitive and boring. There are glimpses of more interesting stories – Heinlein could do a lot of neat world building and exploring with a space and time traveling protagonist, and some interesting sounding planets are mentioned -- but all the other planets Lazarus spends time on are pretty much Earth/Terra with a few animals that don’t exist here. In fact, because so much of the story is focused on relationships The reader is rarely taken beyond the walls of whatever building Lazarus is in.

Characterization: Characterization is one of the biggest issues in “Time.” Lazarus is obviously an avatar for Heinlein himself, and he is also a Marty-Stu. Anything anyone can do, Lazarus can do better. He’s the smartest, toughest, most desirable man in any world. He’s prone to lecturing the reader and those around him. The other men in the stories tend to be tough soldiers, dumb foils for Lazarus to beat, or undeveloped “yes men” who are in awe of Lazarus though they are supposed to be superior citizens themselves. Justin and the younger Ira are pretty much the same character. Galahad is the creepy uncle that you wouldn’t leave alone with your kids. The women are Barbies – they may have different hair or eye color, or live in different times or on different planets, but they’re all made from the same mold. All the main women are the prettiest, smartest, best at their job/role, and most sexually free women of their time and place. Not one of them has a distinctive personality. There’s never a situation where one woman goes “She may like that, but I don’t.” Instead, they are all fantasy women, ready to agree with Lazarus and drop their bloomers or hike up their skirts at any time. In addition, most of them have a scene where they beg Lazarus to impregnate them, and at least three of the times there is a convenient little batch of trees to do it in. How nice of the trees to always be around when women are telling Lazarus they need his baby!

Incest: Incest is a common theme in “Time.” In the story Lazarus has sex with his mother (who thinks he is her half-brother), his identical twin sisters, his “adopted daughter” who he raised since she was three, and a computer-turned-human who he also calls his adopted daughter. Incest is not just for Lazarus. There are also the “mirror twins” Llita and Josie. Heinlein brushes incest off as being no big deal as long as unhealthy babies aren’t produced, but doesn’t take into account how it often creates an unequal power dynamic, something that will be talked about below.

Hebephilia: There is a lot of hebephilia in “Time.” Pre and post pubescent girls are frequently sexualized. At an age of somewhere around eleven to thirteen, Lazarus’ identical twin sisters are taking nude baths with adult men, and are soaping them up and getting soaped up by them. This could maybe get a pass, except that one of the men refers to a twin as “hot” and the girls are being “coached” about sex. At one point Lazarus calls Dora, his adopted daughter turned wife, an “adorable child” before talking about how he’ll sleep with her. Then there are comments like this: “And little Libbie was a redheaded pixie so endearingly sexy at eleven that even I could feel it.” These child/adult relationships are another place where Heinlein had created very unequal relationships.

Relationships: The main relationships in “Time” are portrayed as being very progressive and healthy, but they are actually very primitive and unhealthy.
I’m fine with polyamorous relationships that are equal and mutually consenting. That is not what is seen in “Time.” There is always a power imbalance between Lazarus and the women he sleeps with. Sometimes they are his adopted daughters who he raised from childhood and who he has a direct authority role over (Dora, the twins, and Minerva to some degree). Sometimes they are women who he is withholding information from (his mother), and sometimes they are women who gain status from having children with him (Tamara, Ishtar, Hamadryad).
The house on Tertius comes across as being a Charles Mason Family situation. Lazarus is at the top of the hierarchy. He’s the Senior. He’s in control and the other characters kowtow to him. The men that are his “co husbands” are obviously lower than him in status. They are underdeveloped “yes men” who don’t add anything to the story, but get to sleep with the women. They are forced to take an oath to “the family” when they join.
The women (of which there are quite a few more than the men) for all their supposed skills, are there to please the men and have babies. They constantly talk about wanting Lazarus to impregnate them, needing to get pregnant, getting pregnant, being pregnant, or about how many children they’ve had. Having children with the Senior and other high-ranking men is how they get or retain their status. However, for all the talk about children, they are rarely ever seen – probably because it ruins the fantasy. Even with Lazarus’ birth family, the youngest children are hardly mentioned. Heinlein is much more interested in the teenage girls.
The women acknowledge that they are there to please the men. Lazarus’ mother tells him “A woman must fit any size. Father told me that long ago and taught me exercises for it.” The twins, while “little girls,” tell about how “Mama Hamadryad and Mama Ishtar were coaching them in beginning and advanced sensuality.”
Lazarus judges women by their sexuality. When his mother tells him that, on her marriage day, his maternal grandmother advised her to put up with sex, Lazarus automatically decides he doesn’t like her “I don’t think I would get along with a woman who thinks sex is something to ‘put up with.’” That his grandmother could have been smart, kind, and sexually compatible with someone other than his grandfather doesn’t matter.

Rape Jokes: In one part of the book Lazarus and his wife Dora are in a situation where men are planning to kill him and rape her. It’s treated seriously, which makes the frequent rape jokes in other parts of “Time” seem incongruous. Yet, there are quite a few of them:
“Galahad,” said Ishtar, “if you are going to rape Minerva, drag her back of the fountain. I want to hear what Justin means by that”
“How can I rape her when she won’t fight?” he complained.
“You’ve always been able to solve that problem. But do it quietly.”
—--
“Does my frankness shock you?”
“No. But it might get you raped right on this bench!”
—--
“No, no, do touch me and don’t stop the car! Or I might rape you.”

My father was in his early twenties when “Time” was published. I asked him if rape jokes would have been acceptable at the time, and he said they would have been distasteful even then. They certainly don’t come across well now, especially in a book that likes to think of itself as progressive.

Sex: If a story is going to be about a character’s sexual escapades, the sex should at least be good. However, the sex and expressions of desire in “Time” are almost embarrassingly bad:
“Theodore, I needed to be baby-stretched to accept you .”
—--
“Briney beloved, I’m going to have him once more, as hard as possible!”
—--
“ Hard, Theodore! This time don’t be gentle!”
—--
“I promise you solemnly that I will never bed with anyone but a warrior, a man to be proud of in every way.”
—--
“Beloved, I was so hard I ached – until we found Woodrow. Honey love, I was rarin’ to go!”


Overall, “Time Enough for Love” is an old man’s (boring) fantasy. Don’t waste your time.

I love Lazarus Long. That is all.

I think RAH transcends mere sexuality (or he's a horny old goat, one) and winds a tale in his 'future history' series that is unlike anything else I've ever read. IOW, I don't think he could have quite told the tale without sorta 'getting rid' of standard morals about sex and love.

This IS one of my favorites of the series, but I've got to re-read it to remember why I was left with such strong sentiment about this particular book. It, along with Number of the Beast, has gag-worthy sex scenes if that sort of thing bothers you, but I think the sex scenes were really meant to put away the sex and create a new reality. I generally wasn't interested in the um, scientific improbabilities? ...or the morals, of the strange sex scenes. I found I could get through them by trying to find metaphor [where, okay, MAYBE he meant to write soft porn and I was looking past it too much, heh.]

If anything bothered me about this super-human incestuous bunch of long lifers, it was that I was concerned that they were too cocky, maybe too TOO removed from humanity, that if one of them were raped or hurt during one of their myriad adventures, the typical fare of a silly kiss and/or strange sex or medicine wouldn't quite patch them up. If one killed themselves, they probably all would. IOW, they started to seem cult-like with no leader. (Which I'd imagine was NEVER RAH's intention.)

I love Lazarus Long, cranky old coot who needed to be put in his place and that place, at least in part, is (in part) in my consciousness. Which put these books on my Favorites List.

It was different than a lot of the books I have read, but the story was different and engaging.