آن شاعر بزرگ از زبان خدایان فقط می‌گوید «بجویید تا بیابید» همین و بس.
-شاهرخ مسکوب

تجربه‌ای که شاید بعدا دوباره اتفاق نیافته. مثل تب خاکی روی پشت‌بوم

Read for University!

I thoroughly enjoyed this translation of Sophocles Theban plays. Robert Fagles placed the plays in the order written, rather than in their dramatic chronology. At first I thought this was strange, but I followed his lead and read 'Antigone' first. Now, after reading Oedipus the King and Oedipus at Colonus, I have a much greater feeling for Antigone's suffering and a much better understanding of Creon's perspective as well. Now I'm ready to re-read Antigone better armed with the facts of their respective histories.

Beyond that, what can I say about Sophocles? He treats these myths with genius skills, contemporary mastery of his times and a deep understanding of his fellow Athenians. An amazing accomplishment and an important work for any serious student of drama or literature to read deeply and repeatedly.


The Thug perspective:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMD18...

***************

2015 reread:

Everything I said above and then some. The more Greek drama I read, the more I understand the sources and obsessions of western literature.

سوای از این‌که با یک اثر ادبی طرفیم که هر علاقه‌مندی می‌تونه بخوندش، با یک منبع درسی برای دانشجویان هنرهای نمایشی و روانشناسی مواجه‌ایم که خوندنش برای اون‌ها یک ضرورت به حساب می‌آد.
کتاب شامل یک مقدمه به شدت جذاب از شاهرخ مکسوب، نمایشنامه‌های "ادیپ شهریار"، "ادیپ در کلنوس " و "آنتیگنه" و مقاله‌ی "آنتیگنه و لذت تراژیک" از آندره بونار است.

So... not over-rated. Fagles' translation is solid, much clearer than his Aeschylus, though I actually prefer the opacity he brought to that text. Of course, that might have been in Aeschylus. I will never learn Greek well enough to tell.

Antigone was the earliest of these plays, though the last within the narrative. I can't help but read it with my Hegel glasses on: the clash between Creon and Antigone is an example of a failed conceptual grasp of the world, in which the claims on us of family/tradition/ancient gods cannot be accommodated by our living in larger, civic communities. Divine law and human law sometimes do not go together, but only a tyrant would insist on hewing to the latter alone. Removing the Hegel glasses, I can see that Creon, to his credit, does change his mind. But this being Greece, by then it's all too late. The 'lesson', if you like, is simply that one has to exercise excellent judgment in these matters.

This question of judgment works through the Oedipus plays, as well; each tyrant (Oedipus in OK, Creon in OC) fails to use good judgment; the good king Theseus does exercise it, and thus Athens rules etc etc... I know we're 'meant' to think that these plays are really about always bowing down to the gods and accepting fate, but that just doesn't square with what actually happens: Athens succeeds because of Theseus's wisdom just as much as his piety; Thebes will eventually fall because of its kings' folly just as much as their impiety. In OK, Oedipus has the chorus's support in his argument with Tiresias, because Oedipus's defeat of the Sphinx acts as proof of his regality; but when he accuses Creon without evidence, they give up on him... because by acting without evidence, he shows poor judgment. And so on.

The best play for reading is easily Oedipus the King, which is horrifying and glorious in equal measure. Also, if anyone out there knows of a good book on Tiresias, let me know.

As for Knox's introductory essays, they're not particularly thrilling. There's too much plot-summary (good news for freshmen, I guess), and his insights are so skewed ("these plays aren't depressing! They're about how we do have some control over our lives!") that it's hard to take him seriously. but they're still worth reading.

Of happiness the crown and chiefest part
Is wisdom, to hold the gods in awe.
This is the law
That, seeing the stricken heart
Of pride brought down,
We learn when we are old.

I felt an urge to return to the stories that set my mind on fire, way down the tunnels of time, and I chose blindly, or so I thought. Enjoying them even more today than I did the first two dozen times I read them, I nonetheless wondered why these plays ... and why now? In the middle of reading half a dozen other books, I still felt restless, and kept circling the bookcases, looking for something more satisfying. If ever there was a time to read, and understand Greek tragedy, it is now, given how the latest political events are shaping our world.

In a time fraught with willing blindness, much as Oedipus himself adopts an unwillingness to see the truth before him, these plays are a reminder of the dangers that can ensue when we choose not to see what is so plainly before us.

The three plays combined seem to ask the same question: what is the duty of the citizen in the state: to uphold those laws imposed upon them by one man's invention, in The State, be that man ever so stubborn, or so wrong; or to listen to the heart and uphold the greater laws of Nature, and inherently, Humanity.

It is a push-pull of the heart and mind and not so easily resolved as it would seem; and, because we are not gods, the right answer, The Truth, often comes too late, as it did with Creon.

Is there a time, ever, in humanity, when the prophecies were heeded in time? Or are we doomed to repeat this process, to the very end of time itself.

Not even Sophocles can offer an answer on that one.

این کتاب را سال‌ها پیش خواندم، زمانی که به روانکاوی فروید-لکانی بسیار علاقه داشتم و به خاطر نظریۀ «عقده اُدیپ» فروید سراغ این کتاب رفتم و از خواندن آن به شدت لذت بردم، به گونه‌ای که در طول یکی دو هفته هر کدام از سه نمایشنامه را چندین بار خواندم! بعدها که با نیچه آشنا شدم و ستایش او از یونان باستان و فرهنگ تراژیک یونان باستان و به ویژه نمایش‌نامه نویس‌های بزرگ آن دوران را دیدم و با تحلیل‌های نیچه از تراژدی و فرهنگ تراژیک یونان بایتان آشنا شدم بیش از پیش به ارزش واقعی این نمایش‌نامه‌ها پی بردم و دوست داشتم که بار دیگر این کتاب و البته دیگر نمایش‌نامه‌های تراژیک یونان باستان را بخوانم، باشد که این آرزو برآورده شود

n  n    When we face such things the less we say, the bettern  n

So my review will be brief. Picking this up I was quite a bit intimidated: 3 ancient Greek plays in English translation? I nearly expected not to understand anything at all or barely managing to follow the story. I worried in vain.

The whole time Sophocles made me go like this:

«ای رنج!کجا هستم ؟آیا این صدای من است که در هوا سرگردان است؟دست تقدیر مرا به کجا می راند؟»
افسانه های تبای شامل ۳ نمایشنامه ی تراژدی است که در تلاش برای به یاد آوردن قدرت تقدیر است.سوفوکلس ادعا میکند که «قوانین خدایان از آن دیروز و امروز نیست.هیچ کس آغازشان را نمی داند.اما آن ها جاودانه هستند.»
به شخصه نسبت به تقدیر گرایی شدید سوفوکلس احساس خوبی نداشتم و به طور کلی حتی برای مردی به بزرگی ادیپ قدرت اراده آزاد را حذف کرده و سعی در اثبات بی گناهی ادیپ دارد.اما در کل نویسنده در شخصیت سازی به خوبی عمل کرده همان طور که در کتاب آمده«یک شاعر بزرگ هرگز به طراحی یک شخصیت ممتاز نمیپردازد.وجود او در هر یک از آفریدگانش است.»و این که سوفوکلس در عین زشتی هر شخصیت زیبایی ها وظرافت شخصیت ها را نشان میدهد نشان دهنده قدرت نویسندگی نفس گیر اوست.

اگر صرفاً اودیپوس را به واسطه‌ی فروید و عقده‌ی اودیپ می‌شناسید، پیشنهاد می‌کنم فرض کنید در این باب هیچ نمی‌دانید و اصل نمایشنامه را بخوانید.

اودیپوس شهریار، اودیپوس در کلنوس، و آنتیگنه، سه نمایش‌نامه در این اثرند که در پی و ارتباط یکدیگر می‌آیند.

هر چه که از دنیا می‌خواهید ، در تراژدی‌های یونان باستان می‌توانید پیدا کنید !