Tho dated (1983) it remains a fascinating read. The chapter on Scotland and Highland tropes is attack history at its best. The chapter on Wales should be force fed to “Celtic Fantasy” writers. Most interesting though are the chapters on Africa and India: I’m sure they need rewriting but both are powerful discussions of the use of invented tradition both to develop colonialism and to resist it.

The one chapter I found annoying was the one on the British monarchy which was only interested in England. V frustrating.

Me ha aburrido...

... y el tema era interesante: cómo se han ido forjando presuntas tradiciones con fines e intereses políticos: el kilt y sus tartans para crear una idea de Escocia, el uso de la corona británica como símbolo para unir a la nación, la creación de títulos en la India colonial para absorber las tradiciones locales e integrarlas en la cultura que los colonizaba...

Quizá uno de los problemas ha sido que todo el libro ha estado orientado a la cultura y sociedad británicas, lo que me lo ha hecho un poco lejano. O quizá una gran abundancia de nombres y datos, algo muy útil como fuente de documentación pero que hace pesada una lectura simplemente interesada, o una evidente falta de esmero en la edición, con frases incompletas y errores fruto de no darle una relectura atenta.

El caso es que se me ha hecho bola y me ha llevado más de mes y medio. Si no lo he dejado ha sido más por terquedad que por un sincero interés en el libro.

Δυνατό βιβλίο, ίσως δεν είμαι στην καλύτερη θέση να το διαβάσω λόγω του ότι αφιερώνεται κυρίως στη Βρετανία, μια περιοχή για την οποία αγνοω πολλά. Ιδιαίτερα ενδιαφέρον το κεφάλαιο του Cannadine για τις βασιλικές τελετουργιες

Збірку "Винайдення традицій" можна умовно розділити на дві частини. До першої належать тексти, які прямо стосуються винайдених традицій та націоналізму (вступна і заключна статті Гобсбаума та розвідки про Шотландію і Уельс). Це класичні тексти в дослідженнях націоналізму, з якими і асоціюють збірку "Винайдення традицій". Гобсбаум пропонує теоретичний огляд концепції "винайдених традицій", а Тревор-Ропер ілюструє її історією винайдення кілта та всієї горської традиції Шотландії.

Друга група текстів, здається на перший погляд, не мають стосунку до націоналізмів та ще й є цікавими лише для істориків того чи іншого періоду чи країни. Але це хибне враження. Тексти про винайдені традиції в Індії та Африці демонструють, що націоналізм - це химерний спадок колоніалізму. Принаймні, на рівні ритуалів та символів. Часто колонізовані свій протест проти колонізаторів можуть висловити лише у формі символів, які їм були нав’язані колонізаторами. Звісно, оскільки автори марксисти, то і націоналізм в їх збірці стає продуктом колоніалізму. (І цим автори наближаються до ідей Бенедикта Андерсона про колоніалізм та націоналізм).

А стаття про ритуали довкола короля/королеви у Великобританії - це важливий текст про вивчення ритуалів. Автор ненав’язливо демонструє необхідність врахування низки історичних та соціокультурних обставин при вивченні ритуалів, адже спроби шукати універсальні соціологічні чи антропологічні пояснення є приреченими на невдачу: один і той же символ чи ритуал може набувати різних значень в різних історичних обставинах.

Відтак, попри те, що збірці вже "виповнилося" 32 роки, її досі варто читати!

Genel konusu ve bakış açısı itibariyle özellikle tarihçilerin üzerinde düşünmesi gereken konular. Ama diğer taraftan iskoç kilti, gallerin mitolojik geçmişi gibi bir ingilizi ilgilendirebilecek hatta belki tarihçilerinin bilmesi gereken ama biz türkler için malumatfuruşluktan başka birşey olmayan bir sürü bilgi.
Tavsiye üzerine okuduğum için bana çok şey katacağı, ya da çok farklı bir bakış açısı kazanacağım gibi yüksek bir beklentiyle başladığımdan hayal kırıklığı yaşamış da olabilirim. Eğer tarih bölümünde okuyor ve hocalarınız tarafından devamlı okumalısınız baskısına maruz kalıyorsanız hobsbawm'ın giriş ve sonuç bölümlerini okuyun yeterli olacaktır.

Hayali Cemaatler'de acikta kalmis bir konunun, uluslarin uydurulmasi konusuna da temas ederek, tamamlanmasi. Turkiye'de bu konu temas edilip birakilmis durumda, bu kitaptaki olcude bir arastirma ne yazik ki elimizde yok. Ama Persembeleri sela okuma gibi geleneklerin icat edildigini goruyoruz zaten. Ya da Peyami Safa'nin bir kahramanindan Ulubatli Hasan efsanesi cikarilmasi gibi mesela.

Hobsbawm, sinifsal hikayelerde ya iltimas gecmis, ya da Turkiye tipi ulkelerde solun durumuna ozgu bir durum olabilir ama burada biz bol bol icat edilmis gelenekle karsi karsiyayiz.

Druidleri, kilt etekleri, yeniden yaratilmis kastlari da iceren Iskoc, Gal, Ingiliz, Hindistan ve Afrika gelenek icadi surecleri ancak internet yardimiyla okunabiliyor, cunku benim bilmedigim cok fazla gonderme var. Mesela kis aylarinda tercih ettigim sapkanin Andy Cap adinda bir model oldugunu ve Ingiliz isci sinifi icin zamaninda bir tur kimlik oldugunu buradan ogrendim. :)

Ceviri konusunda fazla sikinti cikmadi. Tek problem Turkceye cevirirken ozgun olacagiz diye asiri turkcelestirilmis terimler. Bu terimleri internette aramak cok zor oluyor.

Edit: https://nisanyan1.blogspot.com/2018/1...

A mixed bunch of studies which seemed to get less and less penetrable as you go on.

This book contains several interested historical studies that show how modern societies have "invented tradition" in order to build the nation-state and community ties. In the end, though, not very theoretically useful. The authors rarely show a methodology or approach that can be used in other work.

This is really about the invention of tradition in relation to the British Empire and how it used and abused these tools throughout its various colonies at various points in history to maintain control and perpetuate ideas and myths to serve their interests and keep their subjects ignorant and compliant, which was all part of the greater and wider Empire narrative.

Granted this is now forty years old, but much of this writing reads as if written in the 19th century. Hobsbawm’s introduction is poor, being too long and clunky. Although he offers many refreshing and illuminating insights, the man famously known for “authenticating” the fake Hitler diaries back in the 80s, Baron Dacre of Glanton AKA Hugh Trevor- Roper’s desert dry prose on the mythology on Highland Scotland is simply horrible to read.

It was interesting to read about the pomp and ceremony related to royals and other political events grew into the ridiculous come the late 1800s and from there it seemed to become a competitive sport among many of the nations of the world, as they each invented their own rituals and mythology squandering much money, which is how today you get millions of morons across the globe tuning into watch the pomp and ceremony of a mediocre elderly man being celebrated and rewarded for the accident of his birth, at the cost of the taxpayer, as at least 3 million people in the same country regularly rely on food banks just to feed themselves and their family.

If the job of the publishers was to go out and find some of the dullest and driest writers and historians in the game circa 1983, then they have done an excellent job. It’s close to a full house of some of the stalest and most static writing you could find, which is a real shame as these are interesting subjects, but as my dad used to say, you can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.

Terence Ranger’s account of Africa was a good read and he makes his points without descending into dull professor mode. And just as the philosopher V.W. said, "he went and saved the best for last," with Hobsbawm’s contribution, but even the best isn’t great and overall this is a really interesting subject, and I would love to have seen it tackled by a better class of writers, because overall this reads more like a series of failed opportunities than a compelling collection.

To start with, let's get a somewhat lengthy definition of the titular concept out of the way.

Invented Tradition is taken to mean a set of practices, normally governed by a set of overtly or tacitly accepted rules and of a ritual or symbolic nature, which seek to inculcate certain values and norms of behavior by repetition, which automatically implies continuity with the past. In fact, where possible, they normally attempt to establish continuity with a suitable historic past.

...

However, insofar as there is such reference to a historic past, the peculiarity of ‘invented’ traditions is that the continuity with it is largely factitious. In short, they are responses to novel situations which take the form of reference to old situations, or which establish their own past by quasi-obligatory repetition.

...

It is the contrast between the constant change and innovation of the modern world and the attempt to structure at least some parts of social life within it as unchanging and invariant.

Finally, Hobsbawm distinguishes this from custom, which "cannot afford to be invariant, because even in ‘traditional’ societies life is not so."

Phew. Okay.

Invented tradition, as bureaucratized custom, has three main purposes:

A.) Establishing social cohesion.

B.) Establishing or legitimizing institutions, status, or relations of authority.

C.) Socialization, inculcation of beliefs, value systems, and behavioral conventions.

Each of these are explored in turn through the context of historical case studies, diving deeply (perhaps dryly) into the granular details of nation-state superstructures (and the material reflections thereof in everything from media to architecture to style of dress) from the late-19th to late-20th centuries.

As an edited volume of chapters, the book starts off feeling like a tedious slog. We explore the origins of 'How Scots became known for kilts and bagpipes' in a way reminiscent of Tolkien's multipage description of Hobbit "pipeweed". Eventually, the writer remembers to bring this back to a broader historical significance.

Things improve throughout from there. The exploration the legitimation of the British crown in colonial India is worth reading as a supplement to historical materialist examination of the base, with an unscrupulous cast of characters who readers of Mike Davis's "Late Victorian Holocausts" will recognize. A similar exploration of the legitimation of the British crown, and both its settler colonial and comprador representatives, is then done for Africa (particularly British more than French colonial Africa).

It helps, naturally, to have an understanding of how reactionary superstructure fills political vacuums (Wendy Brown's "In the Ruins of Neoliberalism") and how idealized reconstructions persist. The book relates this at length to the persistent ceremonial role of the British monarchy at a time when absolutist monarchies of Kaisers and Tsars were being kicked off of the historical stage.

Probably the key takeaway from this volume is:

The point is not merely that so- called custom in fact concealed new balances of power and wealth, since this is precisely what custom in the past had always been able to do, but that these particular constructs of customary law became codified and rigid and unable so readily to reflect change in the future.

The chapter on Scotland is interesting and well-written, but unfortunately the same can't be said for the rest of the book. Most of the chapters ramble without any focus or real point and I ended up skipping parts.

A fascinating book about the preservation but also the creation of tradition by nations and groups like labor groups. For example, most Scottish traditions are rather new. The book was written in 1983 so is dated on things like the British crown. Its glowing comments on public approval would have to be tempered with the scadals of Prince Charles and his divorce. And its notes that sports can be unifying. A fun read.