Gorgias and Phaedrus: Rhetoric, Philosophy, and Politics

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With a masterful sense of the place of rhetoric in both thought and practice and an ear attuned to the clarity, natural simplicity, and charm of Plato's Greek prose, James H. Nichols, Jr., offers precise yet unusually readable translations of two great Platonic dialogues on rhetoric.

The Gorgias presents an intransigent argument that justice is superior to injustice—to the extent that suffering an injustice is preferable to committing an unjust act. The dialogue contains some of Plato's most significant and famous discussions of major political themes, and focuses dramatically and with unrivaled intensity on Socrates as a political thinker and actor. Featuring some of Plato's most soaringly lyrical passages, the Phaedrus investigates the soul's erotic longing and its relationship to the whole cosmos, as well as inquiring into the nature of rhetoric and the problem of writing.

Nichols's attention to dramatic detail brings the dialogues to life. Plato's striking variety in conversational address (names and various terms of relative warmth and coolness) is carefully reproduced, as is alteration in tone and implication even in the short responses. The translations render references to the gods accurately and non-monotheistically for the first time, and include a fascinating variety of oaths and invocations. A general introduction on rhetoric from the Greeks to the present shows the problematic relation of rhetoric to philosophy and politics, states the themes that unite the two dialogues, and outlines interpretive suggestions that are then developed more fully for each dialogue.

The twin dialogues reveal both the private and the political rhetoric emphatic in Plato's philosophy, yet often ignored in commentaries on it. Nichols believes that Plato's thought on rhetoric has been largely misunderstood, and he uses his translations as an opportunity to reconstruct the classical position on right relations between thought and public activity.

248 pages, Hardcover

First published September 1,1998

About the author

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Plato (Greek: Πλάτων), born Aristocles (c. 427 – 348 BC), was an ancient Greek philosopher of the Classical period who is considered a foundational thinker in Western philosophy and an innovator of the written dialogue and dialectic forms. He raised problems for what became all the major areas of both theoretical philosophy and practical philosophy, and was the founder of the Platonic Academy, a philosophical school in Athens where Plato taught the doctrines that would later become known as Platonism.
Plato's most famous contribution is the theory of forms (or ideas), which has been interpreted as advancing a solution to what is now known as the problem of universals. He was decisively influenced by the pre-Socratic thinkers Pythagoras, Heraclitus, and Parmenides, although much of what is known about them is derived from Plato himself.
Along with his teacher Socrates, and Aristotle, his student, Plato is a central figure in the history of philosophy. Plato's entire body of work is believed to have survived intact for over 2,400 years—unlike that of nearly all of his contemporaries. Although their popularity has fluctuated, they have consistently been read and studied through the ages. Through Neoplatonism, he also greatly influenced both Christian and Islamic philosophy. In modern times, Alfred North Whitehead famously said: "the safest general characterization of the European philosophical tradition is that it consists of a series of footnotes to Plato."

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April 1,2025
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Fascinating stuff. In "Gorgias," Socrates talks to an orator, convincing him that oratory isn't that great because either you need to be an expert in other fields or a liar to be good at it. Then some rambunctious people take over the discussion for the orator, saying that all power is good (one of them sounds like a more lucid Nietzsche or a more profound Trump) to which Socrates says that doing wrong to others is the worst thing you can do against yourself, finishing that maneuver off in affirming the immortality of the soul and foretelling his own martyrdom. A regular afternoon.
The "Phaedrus" is a strangely flirtatious conversation between Socrates, the old man, and the beautiful youth Phaedrus. In it, Socrates shows that he can be quite an orator himself when he feels like it, then gets around to describing what we call "Platonic Love," a love which, while excited by the beautiful image of the earthly beloved, is actually a love for the transcendent. Plato is a genius and, as CS Lewis says, his Socrates is one of the few historical characters you feel like you've met once you read their disciple's description of them (his others are Jesus and Samuel Johnson. Good company).
April 1,2025
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I read both Plato's Gorgias and Plato's Phaedrus each semester for my Rhetoric in Western Thought classes and I use Plato's Phaedrus each time I teach undergraduate or graduate classes on Persuasion. Plato is interesting and intriguing. He is literary, poetic, and uses the dialectical interactions as ways to interest the reader and keep them wondering what is going on--at least somewhat. Students regularly seem frustrated because Plato, even in an English translation, is not easy to discern. He requires you to take some work and effort to understand him. However, the rewards are astounding. There is a plethora of ideas we draw from these texts--but have forgotten that we do. It is always a joy to see students struggle through these texts and then find the nuggets of thought and other valuable concepts and ideas. This makes my job that much more enjoyable!
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